Rich Witmer's 24 hours of pastoral insults

Rich Witmer posted the following comments to my MySpace blogs before I moved to this Web site. These quotes are representative of Rich's immaturity and un-Christian ways. I ask: What Christian pastor would say these things to another person? What kind of example is he setting for his flock?

"You are a liar and a coward, you are pathetic and weak." – Oct. 12, 2006

You know nothing about being a Christian. And, for the record, you are not a man. Sit, boy." – Oct. 12, 2006

"My BMW is not new (2004), but you don't have to change that because in January I am getting a new one." [I had previously written that Rich drove a new BMW.]– Oct. 12, 2006

"You are providing great entertainment for me and my friends. You are providing hours of humor for us! No one listens to you! hahahhaha ... stay stupid, it's more fun for me. Thanks for the jokes! heel, girl.  " – Oct 12, 2006

"If you want to do a mental 'thrust and perry' [sic] bring a sword next time! role [sic] over boy  " – Oct. 13, 2006

"The only time anyone reads what you write is when you write about me. does someone need to be taken for a walk?" – Oct. 13, 2006

"hahahahhaha ... that's so dangerous! real bravery in action. thanks for keeping me safe, kids. austin, are you keeping me safe from doughnuts? hahahhahah" [This comment was in response to a former church member, Austin, telling Rich that even though Yuma isn't a war zone, Marines put their lives on the line because they volunteer to wear the uniform. Austin is a retired Marine.]– Oct. 13, 2006

"challenge to take it to the ring? hahahahaha... gained a few since the corp, [sic] huh? hahahhahahhahah..... yep, cowards.... both of you I can get a tandem leash." [This comment was directed at Austin, the retired Marine,  and me.] – Oct. 13, 2006

"I'm going to buy a little female dog and name it john. hahahahahahahhahah..." – Oct. 13, 2006

The annotation "[sic]" means the mistake was a verbatin reproduction of the original and is not a transcription error.

Rich Witmer should read Luke 19:22 - "Out of thine own mouth I will judge thee!"

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  • 2/18/2007 8:04 PM carlo wrote:
    hey, how about posting the entire converstaion... we can judge base on the context what the pastor is trying to say... -carlo from the philippines
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    1. 3/1/2007 10:29 PM John wrote:
      The comments you see are exactly what the "pastor" meant; they don't need context. However, when I get around to it, I will scan and upload the original MySpace blogs as PDF files. In the meantime, consider why a pastor would EVER say these things. As much as I wish he kept posting these comments to my blogs, I'm glad he learned his lesson (obviously, someone in his cult who has a better head on his or her shoulders than Rich does told him to stop).

      Rich Witmer has no formal training in the Bible, has no Biblical or theological degree, and has never formally studied the Bible under a qualified theologian. It's important to note that real Christian churches require people to have a master's degree in divinity before earning ordination and pastorship. Rich Witmer's ordination is a business relationship with Cesar Castellanos, the inventor of the G12 cult movement.

      Furthermore, Witmer's immature and un-Christian comments are the result of his lack of understanding and his inadequate education as a church leader. Simply, there is no excuse for his behavior. The church is focused solely on making money and recruiting new members for the purpose of making more money.

      It's sad ...
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      1. 9/28/2009 11:45 AM Tanya wrote:
        It is sad that Rich can start a church without any formal theology/divinity degree from any accredited (spelling) school and the only religious training that his wife Melissa has is several years of Catholic Catechism. I find it ironic that Melissa's brother Richie Ray has a minor in Theology from the University of Arizona and she's the one that became a "Pastor". How SAD IS THAT?
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    2. 4/13/2007 5:44 AM Maureen wrote:
      Regardless of the context or content of the entire block of text the comments are ridiculously immature and argue NOTHING. They are unbecoming of anyone, especially someone claiming to be a Christian and a Christian leader at that. I'm glad that the bible speaks of holding leaders to a higher accountability for their actions. I hope his 'flock' reads this and sees how he responds to opposition-not with biblical truth but with name calling. Nice.
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      1. 8/7/2007 6:56 AM Anon wrote:
        I'm sorry to say that not only does he do these things, but his "flock" joins in. They even cheer his actions. When he belittles someone, "he's just being real". Yeah, I speak from experience.
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    3. 1/28/2010 1:33 PM William wrote:
      As a person from the Yuma area, I'm familiar with this "church" and it's tactics. In my opinion, any religion that emphasizes monetary growth over spiritual and moral growth, is not by definition a church. It is a fund raising organization. This parish also uses ambush like tactics to bring worshipers into the fold. If you've ever been to one of their haunted houses, or community events, you've been in the middle of their prayer circles in which you cannot leave until you give in to their thinking. Being cornered and surrounded does not make me feel safe or make me want to become involved. It makes me feel creeped out and want to run away.
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  • 5/6/2007 11:29 PM Unlearn this wrote:
    This is a verbatim message sent to me responding to a comment I posted on John's audio in YouTube. I assume this person goes to Generations Church. Isn't this strangely similar in style to Rich's comments to John?

    "look, you don't even know pastor rich, so why do you say crap about him and say that what he preaches is wrong?? you don't even know his beliefs, and ya know, people have different beliefs, and they preach differently, and you can't change that!! keep your bullshit comments to yourself, if you have different opinions, and decide to ridicule someone for what they believe in, then you're the one doing wrong. and you're 50!!! what the hell!!! haven't you learned anything from life and religion?? you don't even know what generations is!! please..just learn."

    Learn? I don't consider exploiting people something to be learned. I presume it must come naturally.

    Lovely comment isn't it?
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    1. 1/13/2008 12:49 PM WOW!!!! wrote:
      I just think that all this is childish. Talking back and forth. We were taught that when it come talking about the bible or Jesus Christ, we should not argue. I do attend Generations Church and all this talking back and forth is just ridiculous. I am very sadden about all this situation. I attend church to hear God's word and not to hear critiques about other religions. Come on guys the religion or a church is not going to save you. We all know that. So stop acting like little kids and start paying attention to God's message. After reading all this it is not cool to see a pastor having enough time to sit and read all of this trash. Instead go out and spread God's word. Not enough time to help out a marriage in trouble or teach the cell leader a bit more because sometimes my cell leader does not even know how to explain verses in the bible, but enough time to read trash like this. WOW........ I think both pastors should once every six months take the time and join in on a cell meeting given from one of there G-12 to find out if they are doing well or not. I lived the encounter and I attended the Post encounter. I don't consider my self a reject from Generations but a disappointed member. I love God and for him and with him. Where ever I go.
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      1. 10/4/2008 11:49 AM falsely accuses wrote:
        The only one acting like a child is Rich Witmer. I was a leader in that church. I was falsely accused, my cell and my wife's cell closed within 12 hours without even speaking to us. His onesidedness. He said I was rebellious because I stood up to them and tried to speak my mind because I was falsely accused and he didn't want to hear it. The only way he would meet with me is with a camera crew? Rich spends more time trying to defend himself than paying attention to what his true purpose is. He is arrogant, and yes this all sounds petty, all these comments. But as I told him, truth is truth. Ther emust be truth to all this if many of us are facing the same thing here. I defended this man, and thought this site was crazy until it happened to us!
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        1. 2/8/2010 10:36 PM Julie Saucedo wrote:
          I can so relate to this comment.
          My husband and I were part of a G 12 church for almost 10 years; they got into the G 12 vision after we had already been going there for about 6 years. Reading about other people having bad experiences with G 12 really bothers me, because it tore our family apart, and I know it's spreading like wild-fire all over the planet. I want to warn people, but my son may disown me if I get too vocal (or post stuff online) and he and his wife are expecting our first grandchild in June, so it's hard for me to know what to do....
          I have been a born again Christian for the past 37 years, and before that was raised in the Lutheran church. It's astonishing to me that people like my husband and I could be fooled into thinking that this vision was really from God. But after all, as has been pointed out to me, we are living in the last days, and the Bible says that many false prophets will arise and will seduce if it were possible, even the elect.
          I keep praying for my son, that he will be delivered from the mind control he is is hard to see him being manipulated and exploited by the system he is entrenched in, serving the leaders, all the while thinking he is serving God.
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  • 6/28/2007 10:37 PM Becca wrote:
    "challenge to take it to the ring? hahahahaha... gained a few since the corp, [sic] huh? hahahhahahhahah..... yep, cowards.... both of you I can get a tandem leash." [This comment was directed at Austin, the retired Marine, and me.] – Oct. 13, 2006.... thats my DAD!! austin is my daddy!! woot!! anywho..... i know all bout the situation with rich and my dad..... and i would agree with you on the fact that what rich said is childish and stupid.... GROW UP!!!!
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    1. 10/4/2008 11:52 AM falsely accused wrote:
      yeah, I know your dad too, funny same thing happened to me by his same leader under Rich and with Rich. Little power issues they have going on. Must be truth if it keeps repeating itself with many people, and I attended your dad's cell too before he closed
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  • 6/4/2008 6:48 PM Peter Vandever wrote:
    I have given Carlos tons of my time to talk to him and he is a clone of this pastor. However, these men needs to realize the love of God is manifest only when we love the people who are weak and broken. If we do turn our heart to the homeless and the widows, our "religion" is sick in the eyes of God. I believe, err, well controlling spirits. It is the spirit of control. Bob Momford and Derek Prince for doing this stuff in the 1980's. Is the Sherpherding movement dead?

    You want true Christianity? Don't run to the conference centers for crusades (I am a crusade evangelist) but ALSO stop for the broken widow on the side of the road that the intercessor and the pastor passed. True Christianity is reaching the poor. Prosperity is for the poor, not the BMW dealership!!!

    A pastor friend of mine had a Benz and he was on the floor of Brownsville AG in 1999 and God told him to sell it and get a Kia or he would lost the tranny and engine on the way back home. He did it. Why? so that gospel can be preached to the poor of the earth. Prosperity is not for us but it is through us!

    Sadly, we look at the poor of the earth as we go to our g12 cell ministry and be pharisee saying "better then than me!"

    I am also told his pastor in AZ says "get in a cell or go to hell." Can someone say control, guilt trip and heresy. I will amen them!
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    1. 7/15/2011 4:40 PM Bellabob wrote:
      I have recently "escaped" from a G12 church in Natchez, MS. I won't go into a lot of personal detail, except that I was in various major leadership positions in that church. I spent more time at the church than I did at home with my family, trying to fulfill weekly requirements. We were given consequences for not fulfilling all the requirements, and made to feel like a failure if you did not get it allcompleted. The tasks were that of a 20-25 hour a week part time job. A lot of this came down because the pastors embraced Rich's "success", along with another pastor in Mexico, John Wilson. The G12 was a doctrine of witchcraft from the get go, although I could not see it at first. Like others have said, at first glance it appears passionate andcommitted. It is really control and fear that motivate it. I totally feel like an idiot for staying in it 7 years, and constantly repent for the harm i caused others that were "under" me. My family has been very damaged by this.

      We lost so many friends over this too. They are verycommitted to the vision, not people. They have asked recently people support the vision by supporting Bray Sibley with a $12 a month offering and another $100 a month above your tithe, as a "conquerer" offering. Forget the lives that have been destroyed. Just keep going and tell people that the ones who left had issues they didn't want to confront.
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  • 7/25/2008 9:21 PM left them already wrote:
    control. guilt trip. heresy.

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  • 12/12/2008 1:36 PM jeane wrote:
    Generations church is a cult...that's it!! When I used to faithfully go there, I was about 11, I went to their encounter being to young to understand that it leads to becoming a cell leader. At the time there were no kids cells. They pressured me every time to open a cell. I had too much going on with my family and with school so I was in no position to open a cell. My mom went to a different church, and she became furious with the church for pressuring me into something I wasn't ready for. My mom told me NO...because I was too young and had too much going on in my life. After letting my cell leader know I couldn't do it, she started to act differently. Almost as if I was evil or started to hate god. Well that doesn't seem christian like to me. My friends cell leader started telling her not to be around me because I was a bad influence. (Because I didn't open a cell). I can't stand that church. They are totally judgemental and turn on anyone who doesn't open a cell. I speak from experience. Not only did this happen to me...but to my bestfriend and her mom. they no longer go there and have not regretted it once.
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  • 6/26/2010 1:35 PM Prez wrote:
    I have to say i totally agree about Rich. I went to several of their meetings and was very surprised at the lack of maturity that he had. This was further confirmed when i was having a haircut and he was also there on the phone bragging to his buddy how he had put some guy down on myspace. My thought was, shouldn't a Pastor be acting in a "what would Jesus do" type capacity? If Jesus came down tomorrow and visited that Church, he would be very disappointed and ashamed.
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  • 10/11/2010 9:21 PM Bubba wrote:
    I live in Tempe and I have attended Generations ASU, and I have attended there cell Group. I at first thought they were zealous and passionate. I was rcommended by a friend of a friend and met up with some one out of church leadership. I felt like the guy dodged some of my questions and tried to flatter me. I was interested, and with my curiosity I had go check this church out. I attended, their cell group and church my First red flag was numbers. Even at cell group i was asked about my friends and people that i lived with. I wasn't at all interested in getting anyone involved into something i am checking out until i am for sure its biblically sound. Back home we had our own group who met up from different churches where we would do a little devotional time, Pray for people, give prayers of thanks. have some fellowship time and worship. Their cell group and church didn't have a lot of meat in its sermons, sure they were witty and fill with factual information, but didn't rely on a lot of biblical information. Some verses I felt were twisted and taken out of context and this rose to have more questions, about who these guys were. Second big flag was tithing. I grew up with the belief that if tithing is important, but its not encouraged if your not a member, or a regularly attending. Also, if your not being felt led by god to give. I do believe in tithing whole heartedly but i am not going to tithe to a church i am just checking out unless led to give by god.I do give to one back home. I also find it funny they focus on tithing financially and considers it the only true way to tithe. Third Flag was their "encounter" they kept pushing me to attend. They seemed to be secretive about encounter and told me i had to experience it to understand. THIS grabbed my attention and my gut told me this place is not for me and it has some issues. I attend for a couple weeks longer, and try to talk with one of the people there. I said i had some things i would like to address over lunch sometime and maybe he could answer my question. Friends often have lunch and talk, even over some differences. This guy, Dodged me, and only wanted to meet up with a group of his friends. Again, I tried to set up a one on one, but the guy kept trying to make sure he had me out gunned in numbers. I grew up beliving if you and a friend had a different opinion on a scripture is was a good opportunity, to grow and learn. Maybe god will reveal something. There was no chance that this was going to happen,this guy seem to grow to have animosity towards me. There were several other little flags that came up like prosperity teaching,Finding hobbies to make friends, to get them tocome to Generations, and them being pushy. They do act like they want to be friends, but are FAKE. Again, they cut and paste with the scriptures. If its unpopular to put a teaching besides the scriptures,and to test it, I rcomend on getting out. My experiences and their tactics point to a Cult.
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  • 8/14/2011 7:49 PM pinayforJESUS wrote:
    Rich was seen in Waterfront HOtel Casino when he went to Philippines, Cebu City in the year 2010. I am so glad that i am out from my old church who joined G12.
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